I'm pondering over an issue and I'm not entirely sure how to handle it. One of my members is, well, a Mary Sue. She joined in the very beginning, when the majority of our members were very new to roleplaying. Rather than getting rid of her, I decided to try and work with her. She's an excellent writer and all; she just hasn't gotten out of the Mary Sue stage yet. And since most people admit to making Sue-ish characters in the beginning, I felt like there was hope with her.

And in her defense, she has gotten a little better. She's stopped coming up with idiotic plot twists that make no sense. But for the most part, her main characters are always unhappy (unless they have a boyfriend/mutual crush). If you read one of her threads, you can be guaranteed she's sucking sympathy out of another character. In my opinion, she uses sympathy to draw attention to herself and her characters, particularly when male characters are concerned. She's dead set on coupling up every one of her characters; and I feel she lives vicariously through her characters' love lives (as she's said multiple times that she's never had a boyfriend).

There have also been issues of her having what seems to be an unnatural obsession with a former (character) love interest. She would show up in almost every thread he was in, whether it made sense for her character to be there or now. I got complaints from other members because she would monopolize the guy's attention, making it impossible for him to roleplay with other characters. I had to tell her twice to back off, and for now it seems like she's listening. But I'm still hearing that the guy's name still comes up in most of her posts.

I've talked to her privately several times, when issues arised, and tried to steer her away from constantly whining with her characters. I know that several members have talked to her privately over the past year as well. There have even been public discussions in the C-box as well as threads in which people have tried to talk the girl and explain that they're fed up with constantly having to comfort her characters. And every time she responds with saying that it's just how she writes, and she's not going to change it for anyone. Now, I understand that people are drawn to roleplaying to express and write for themselves; but there is also a sense of cooperation and collaboration that goes along with roleplaying. She doesn't seem to care how other people feel so long as she is happy herself. It's almost like she feels like the other characters are just there to serve her own agenda.

Recently, I've been talking with the rest of my staff to see how they feel and whether or not she should be told to shape up or ship out. I'm on the fence about the issue myself. Quite honestly, I'm tired of dealing with her lack of respect for everyone else, and of getting complaints about her. But at the same time, I don't want to start telling people what they can or cannot do with their characters; whether they can be happy or sad and whatnot.

What would you do in this situation? She seems to have found a love interest for one of her characters, but I know she'll go right back to her old ways when it falls apart. Should I go ahead and confront her about it or just see how things play out? I also don't know how to tell her to get things together. "Stop being emo" isn't going to cut it. I'm having trouble finding the line between putting my foot down and controlling her characters.

I've had little experience with members as problematic as this one, but I can tell you that if multiple members have been complaining about her for a long time, and if I'm getting annoyed just reading about it, you have since crossed the horizon of "enough". In fact, you've most likely exceeded escape velocity and you're not even in the atmosphere anymore.

What I'd say you need to do is be blunt about it. I, personally, am a bad person and would probably chase her out, but what you can do is get straight to the point and tell her that what she's doing is getting in the way of everybody else's fun, and if she's not willing to cooperate, then she can just leave. You won't necessarily be controlling her characters as you'll leave the decision of what to do with her. Hurting the oh-so-delicate feelings of a Mary Sue factory is better than letting them crash all the threads on your board.

Now, I'm sure somebody else will come along and give you a bit of advice way better than mine, but that's just how I'd handle it if it ever happened on my board. Which I seriously hope it doesn't.

Tell her that in character she needs to take some prozac and check out eHarmony.com.

That'll solve your problem and make her someone else's.




Realistically, just paraphrase what you just told us into a PM and send it to her as a final warning. If she doesn't comply, ban her.

Not much you can do when Mary stops taking her happy pills.

Trust me, enough is enough in this case.

Give her one last warning, and if she doesn't listen, show her the door. Your members will thank you for it.

Oh. Poor you, sounds like you’ve got yourself stuck in her fantasy. I have seen and been in similar problems. You are completely right; everyone makes a Mary Sue at the beginning because when you are new, it's all exciting and I guess something in you wants to be completely perfect, everything you aren't in real life. My first ever writing online was via fan fiction and my main character could not have been more Sueish.
But you see, it didn't take me a year to realise that was wrong. In fact all it took was for me to read my story a week or so later and fall over cackling! It takes people different lengths of time to really get a hold on their writing skills but it sounds to me as if she is arrogant enough to believe she is right and perfect and it doesn't matter to her how many other people are annoyed by her. I don't think you can help her. Enough is enough and the time for you to really lay the law down is now. If other members are complaining you are running the risk of losing your good members, you can't have that. Why lose a lot for one silly person?

I know what you mean when you said you don't want to tell her how to write or how her character should be. I do completely understand you. RPing supposed to be the balance of fiction and reality after all; it's supposed to be fun and different with the elements of emotions and real life goings on. But there is a difference between a character being a little moody and stroppy than a depressed, life sucking monster. She sounds like she is only out to make herself in this other world. She wants attention and a boyfriend because she doesn't have in real life. It isn't your job to play her psychiatrist or to give her what she wants, you have to do what's right for your whole community and if the majority want something done about her, then I think it may be about time to just give her the final ultimatum:

Grow up and start taking advice and calm yourself down or get the hell out of our way.

I'm having trouble figuring out what to say to her. I don't want to come across as the nazi admin, but I don't want her to just shrug off what I say either.

And I know that she'll try to say something to make me feel sorry for her. When people confronted her about her first year character trying to drown herself, she responded with saying she was depressed and had suicidal thoughts in real life (even though she had denied all that when i spoke with her privately before that). When my co-admin and I confronted her about stalking another character, she tried to tell us that no one else would roleplay with her and that's why she showed up in all of her ex-lover's threads (even though that wasn't entirely true).

I know that she'll say something to make me feel sorry for her, so that I'll get off her back. And if she says that her characters are depressed because she is depressed in real life, I'm not sure what I can say that won't sound cold-hearted. It's hard because I think she's full of crap; she makes no mention of having any real problems until someone is on her case about something. And rather than listening to the criticism, she feeds them some story to make them feel sorry for her.

I don't want to fall for her tricks. But, if on the off chance she's telling the truth, I don't want to seem callous. =/

If she's having these problems in real life- or rather, claiming to- then tell her that she should be seeking real help for her problems instead of redundantly enduring them through her characters.

Honestly, though, I'm not that nice, so I'd probably tell her to grow up and give her the boot.

What is wrong with being the Nazi admin?

It shouldn't even be Nazi Admin because what you're doing is protecting your board. Worrying about coming off as a bit of a bitch should be the last thing you concern yourself with. This is not about you, so don't fret about how they'll see you because it really doesn't matter. It sounds like this person is beyond changing their ways. They've been warned, they've been given advice, they've had their wrists slapped over and over and it's still the same old.

So why are you even debating this?

Why are you even considering giving them an ultimatum? They have already proved that they are incapable of adjusting. They've already alienated themselves. They've already made their bed, so let them lie in it.

Do you think the game will benefit from their removal?
Do you think that, realistically, warning them once again will have any long-term effects?
Do you think your players will thank you when she goes back to harrassing them?

No, it isn't an easy thing to do, and yes sometimes it is hard to see what needs doing because you want to be everyone's mate. We can't all really see what's going on game-wise until someone slaps us upside the head. I know I can't.

Looking at it from this point of view, I would not tolerate it and I don't see why you should have to.

If the other members are complaining about her, it's a definite issue, and one person should not be allowed to suck the fun out of a game for everyone else.

I would be honest with her: talk to her and let her know that there have been multiple complaints about her, that the other members are not happy with her, and that they are sucking the fun out of the game for them--and that this is not something you, as an admin, will put up with for the sake of the game. And then present her with her options.

She can either tone it down and play in a more collaborative fashion (she needs to know it's not all about her!), or she will be asked to leave. Explain to her in detail what it is that is grating on everyone.

But there's also the "sink or swim" method which is that if a player is really that bad, no one will want to play with them and the player will either shape up on their own or lose interest when no one plays with them and leave.

I think it becomes something that needs to be dealt with when multiple players are complaining and not having a good time. This sounds like just the situation. And if she's saying she's despressed/suicidal IRL and that's her excuse for the way she RPs?

All the more reason to give her the boot. She is not your responsibility. And if she's that unstable, I would include that in my reason for kicking her out: "It has come to my attention that, perhaps, RPing on my game is not healthy for you as it has proven to be a cataclysm in your own IRL issues. As such, I am releasing you from the game. Please, seek professional help."

...Or something like that. More tactfully worded. I'm sleepy. xD

She's being passive aggressive and manipulative. Don't fall for it. That's what she wants you to do.

As for how to approach her, again, tell her what you said here and be firm in letting her know you will not let her continue to drag you game down.

It's tough, but a single rotten egg can stink up an entire house, so best throw it out before it can, right? That's the same thing with players in a game. She's stinking up th house, and if something's not done, people are gonna start vacating it. :\

If you can't nail her for her character without her pulling the depression card, maybe you'll want to talk to her about her lack of respect for the other players and her inability to cooperate with them and the staff. You can't be the Nazi admin for that.

Besides, talking to one person for the betterment of the whole board is not a bad thing. Multiple people have complained about her, and it would beneficial for the board if she pulled her act together.

She does sound like she's an attention hog. Until you've gotten this sorted out (this will sound callous), maybe you should advise people to stop comforting her characters. It might serve as a wake up call.

Manda, you have a rule against this sort of thing. If she complains about being depressed in real life, then you can refer her to the site rules when you explain that your site isn't the place for her to be dealing with that.

This is when IC comes in.

Get your character to humiliate the hell out of hers. Keep doing it. Repeatedly. When she complains, tell her what your issue is.

Manda, I definitely know exactly where you're coming from.

I have plenty of horror stories about dealing with such a member. I agree with Rhi-Rhi, you should give that member the boot. RP would not be healthy for her. Also, it would not be healthy for the board. I would assume you have exhausted all diplomatic options. If that is the case, I would have to say boot her from your board. She's not your responsibility.

There is a time where you're going to have to get tough. This is one of these times. The member I had to deal with, I keep hearing how he has all these real life issues to deal with. Of course role-play is a means to escape from real life. But, role-play is not the best way to escape from real-life depression. I have already made posts on other threads about this member I had to deal with. I already nicknamed him as "Karl." The boy seemed to have plenty of issues. I'm willing to go as far as to say that your member is the female version of Karl.

I would agree you should tell that member to seek help in real life. However, I highly doubt the member would listen. Only thing left to do would be to boot that member out. If she is that depressed enough in real life to be causing problems on your board, you shouldn't keep her around. In the long run, it will only hurt your board and its activity even more. I do consider Karl to be a pathogen or a pariah. Your member is pretty much become the same thing.

Like that girl, Karl was only looking out for his own satisfaction and agenda. I strongly do feel that Karl is mentally unstable. I'm thinking that the girl is just as unstable as well.

Role-play does serve as an escape. However, role-play serves as the lousiest escape from real life depression. Those types of members will bring the board down. Only those members can help themselves. Most of them choose not too. If you want to escape from real-life depression, role-play is not the best thing to do. However, escaping from depression isn't good either. The more you try to escape from depression, the worst it gets.

The reason I believe the girl is mentally unstable is that there are plenty of role-players with a lot on their plates IRL. And many of the things can downright depress them. However, you don't see any of them causing problems on your board.

In a nutshell, you should give her the boot. You don't need to deal with her drama. Your members don't need to deal with her drama.

I would tell her the problem, then give her a short while to sort it out, then if she hasn't solved her problem i would take the character back to the drawing board and make sure that she doesn't have a mary-sue character "Emo i want boyfriends" and let her know that if she doesn't sort it out you will have to ban her from the RPG or from roleplaying but allow her in the C-boc OOC =] until she feels that she can start up again. But i think this all requires on you enforcing your rule of "No mary-sues| If you have that rule that is...? Since its a characters job to cooperate with everyone else so that everyone enjoys it and not just her.


Eck.. That sounds really harsh O_O
Lol...

I wholeheartedly agree with the sentiment that you need to get tough. I feel for you though, I've had to deal with and have seen the like before, many times. The worst offender was a young (I'm assuming she was young from her OOC carry on) girl on a fun RP board I visited frequently just for escape and humorous RP. Like your member all of her characters were "woe is me I have so many troubles" Mary Sues, and her RPing was 100% angst and attention seeking. Constantly she would even post OOC comments like "*sigh* I am just so depressed today..." and then continue with her equally depressing IC post.

The Admin of that particular board refused to do anything about her, despite numerous complaints (which took a while, most of the members decided to give her the benefit of the doubt and believed that she really did have issues) and despite the fact that she took the other members' IM details and messaged them constantly (myself included) and without their consent. Everytime a new member joined the board she PMed them straight away, asking if they would like to RP and outlining some convoluted story arc that revolved solely around her character, and how the new writer's character could find her crying in the forest, or sitting on the floor with a bottle of pills in her hand, or want to chat her up in front of whatever current boyfriend her character had.

It eventually got to the stage when NOBODY spoke to her, let alone RPed with her. She brought this totally on herself. After many conversations with myself and other members asking her not to take over their own threads and destroy their own particular storylines we'd just had enough. Unfortunately though she'd scared away a lot of members and the board died out fairly soon after.

I agree with Rhi-Rhi and xing. On the off chance that this girl really does have a mental issue (and I highly doubt it, she just sounds like one of those unfortunates who gets no attenion IRL and so gleans whatever she can from the RP world) then she is not your responsibility. You've done all you can and from what I can see of the situation have been exceptionally kind and patient with her. It's time to let her go, whether it's kicking and screaming, her absence can only do good things for the rest of your board.

You really shouldn't worry about sounding horrible. I speak to a guy on MSN who is completely Emo, writes out song lyrics to some very scary sounding songs, tells me about his heartache and how many times he had tried to kill himself in the past week. Everyone tells me to just block him, I don't even know why I talk to him, He was a guy I offered to help with rping so that he could get onto a site with his friends, I regret it but at the same time I hate to block him on the off chance he really is telling me the truth and he really is depressed. But coming of cold is probably the best thing you can do. I do it with him and he talks to me rarely now, he'll tell me that a girl hates him at school or that his brothers prison sentence is nearly over and the whole time I just answer as simply as I can.

She tells you she is doing this in real life, she is really depressed and all that. Then when she tells you that say as clearly as you can.

“That is terrible if you are feeling this way in real life but the thing is, this is a role play site and I am supposed to cater for all members on this site, I am not the only one concerned with your behaviour here and if you really do think you are depressed then I suggest you tell someone about, a teacher or an adult in your life who can help you and get you the proper attention you need. I do not feel it is appropriate to have suicide attempts on this board. We are not here as a club for depression relief we are here for fun. If you do not think you are able to participate in a proper manner then please join another site that is more open to your writing.”

The thing is though. If she really is depressed she wouldn't be telling you she was, someone suffering with depression doesn't always know they are until they are diagnosed as such. When they do know it is unlikely they'll go around admitting it. I can't say that for everyone, maybe some people do openly admit it but a good percentage of depression suffers keep themselves to themselves and will not speak about it with others, even less so to complete strangers. If she is telling the truth then, ok, not sure what you can do about it and she is clearly using this as a way to get what she wants. But in my opinion she is looking to get her own way and have people feeling sorry for her.

Here I speak as one who really knows--I had one hell of a troubled adolescence. So the **** what.

-Depression is not an excuse.
-Boredom is not an excuse.
-Excuses are beside the point.

I see RP as a little like being on a sports team. You have to cooperate with everyone while having your own fun; you have to be part of a bigger victory (good RP), and you have to get along with/listen to your fellow players; above all, you have to put your problems aside when you're on the field (posting IC threads). If you get close to someone, then it's OK to talk about your personal life, but it's easy to tell when you just want some attention, so police yourself.

Simple.

In addition, I've found it's very hard to get a person to change a pattern of behavior. It's much easier to get someone to fix grammar, fix spelling, fix an overly perfect character; it's almost impossible to get one of these angst-bots to change. What generally happens on boards I frequent is simply that no one will RP with the person, and she gives up and leaves. I suppose your members are too kind-hearted... but honestly, that's the subtler way of dealing with it. Or, I suppose, you could put full flame under your patience and PM her.

I've never been in the position to ban someone, myself (apart from spammers). I will say that if you send a reasonable, polite message before doing so, go ahead.